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Post by cottmiler on Mon Nov 18, 2019 11:24 am

Those who get SS’ blogs will have had a short survey asking these details:

Height
Fingertip to fingertip distance then subtract height to get Ape Index
Width and length of a hand
400 m best pace

Paul Newsome will crunch the numbers and it will help develop training ideas.

However, I think he is missing something and that is whether you are porpoise shaped or surfboard shaped. In other words do you have a bulbous chest or flat chest because I think it makes a big difference as to how much body roll you should do when clicking from side to side.

In my case I am surfboard shaped and I think I need to have a lot of body roll and that in turn needs a slow cadence.

What do readers think?


cottmiler

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Post by Don Wright on Wed Nov 20, 2019 9:44 am

Never mind the youngsters "surfboard" or "porpoise" shape - what about some of us oldies that have a bit of a "spare tyre" around the middle, despite efforts to shift it!?

Don Wright

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Post by Sprinter on Thu Nov 21, 2019 8:03 pm

What is "surfboard shaped"?
What is "porpoise shaped"?

Sprinter

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Post by Don Wright on Fri Nov 22, 2019 10:29 am

cottmiler wrote:

...However, I think he is missing something and that is whether you are porpoise shaped or surfboard shaped.  In other words do you have a bulbous chest or flat chest because I think it makes a big difference as to how much body roll you should do when clicking from side to side.


OK so I grumbled about the (little Smile ) "spare tyre" around my middle, but looking at cott's post, he has already explained what he meant, by the red highlighted phrase!  Personally, my rib cage is deeper down at the diaphragm end , than below the clavicles - so I definitely aint a "surfboard" shape i.e. no "bulbous chest",  not much in the way of "pecs" development as body-builders have.  Oh well, it takes all sorts to make a world - at least we haven't so far, mentioned "pear-shaped"!  Rolling Eyes  But does it affect how much body roll we use when FS-ing? I reckon it's more a matter of the hip rotation, rather than the chest.   When I try my inhalation on every 4th arm stroke style, I use very little body roll - aiming to keep a steady attitude with minimal disturbance for inhalations.  After all, we do understand that there exists both "shoulder-driven" and "hip-driven" FS styles.  One of my little FS variants deliberately relies on a quick vigorous hip roll away from a stroking arm starting it's pull - that's the old familiar body roll mantra  "Roll away from the stroking arm going down, and towards it, as the arm is coming up." (leaving the legs inactive as a means to minimize the retarding effect of flutter kicking with my inflexible ankles with insteps kicking water forwards - see my P.S.!) - and for this "variant" I use the standard inhalation on every 2nd arm stroke.  So to sum it up, I guess am more of a "hip-driven" FS body roller!

Think there's little doubt that "lofties",  bods with their longer arms can easily outpace "shorties" with their commensurately sized arms.  So the "shorties" have to use a higher SPM to keep up with the "lofties".  But body roll must be an important factor in movement forwards .  Thrusting a shoulder or hip deeper into the water must present a larger "head-on" profile (causing increased drag) - than swimmers keeping on an even keel. On an old swim DVD I have - the "coach" says that a competitive sprint swimmer will often before a race, walk along the pool deck and decide where to make the inhalations - as few as possible, so as to keep on an even keel!


P.S. On this flutter kicking business - ( I expect Sprinter will "jump" on me regarding this! Rolling Eyes ). I studied again Sheila Taormina's "Swim Speed Strokes" in which she emphasizes the importance of positioning of limbs to press water backwards,  across the various strokes. As a result, I tried improving my "Back Crawl" leg action by dropping the lower leg down to a deeper level than I normally use, so that the shin and foot would "heave" more of a mass of water upwards during the kick upbeats.  It seemed to be a bit better as regards forward movement - but the arthritic bones in my insteps were not happy at being pushed down by resisting water pressure on the kick upbeats - and later that night the pain in my feet awoke me.  Hmmmm!, not sure whether or not to continue with that idea! (At my next session I did try the same idea, but more gently - result - still more pain  SO WILL SADLY, ADD THAT TO MY LIST OF THINGS AN OLDIE CAN NO LONGER DO!) At the start of the kick upbeat, the rising leg's foot will not have much of a "contrary" attitude, but as the leg comes up nearer the surface those inflexible ankles will cause water to be kicked forwards by the "contrary" attitude of the insteps! Sad


Having gone "off-piste" yet again, I might as well continue!  Yesterday as I did my quick hip action mentioned (far above here) it struck me that the "inactive legs" are possibly doing a weak fly undulation as a result of the momentum initiated on by the vigorous hip action.  Think I'll emphasize that a bit more next time, by keeping the legs closer together and leaving the knee joints really relaxed.  Some time ago I did see, on a video clip, a former well-known elite doing FS drills, and in one of them, he did substitute a fly undulatory leg action for the normal flutter kick.  However, I did notice that this produced a "swaying from side to side" of the legs!

Having mentioned fly - I haven't "cracked" yet the problem of fitting in an inhalation by breathing to the side during the peak of the double arm up-sweep.  The "window of opportunity" is so small, before the arms recover over the water and the front of the body does it's mini-dive. Due to a permanent old-age "forward stoop" of the spine, normal inhalation to the front was impossible - the water line occurring about halfway down the nose at best, well above the mouth.  I see that "Go-Swim" has a quite good video clip on this  side breathing which advocates that all "would-be flyers" should at least try it! :-


https://uk.video.search.yahoo.com/search/video?fr=mcafee&p=GoSwim+Butterfly+-+Side+Breathing#id=1&vid=d0ba9da05594b94d760a0dbc04b424d3&action=click

That's a horrendously long "clip link" (what's Mcafee mentioned for, I wonder? Is it just 'cos I've got it installed on my PC and I clicked on the "Google" image  for the item and then copied the address from my "command line"?)

OR - if one can login to the GoSwim website then : -


www.goswim.tv/lessons/999-butterfly-side-breathing

 During my last session, it did strike me that I am making things more difficult for myself by not turning the head to the side sooner before the fly up-sweep gets under way.  By doing that I should be ready to snatch a quick breath at the earliest possible opportunity, as the up-lift caused by the stroking arms raises the head above the surrounding water surface. Hitherto, I've been waiting to feel the strong uplift of the arms at the up-sweep's peak, and then turning the head - a bit late!!! The moment the arms break the surface for recovery their weight will cause the head to drop lower!

Don Wright

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