Does your body type really matter for swimming?

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Does your body type really matter for swimming?

Post by s.sciame on Fri Feb 03, 2017 12:01 pm

Hi all,
it's friday, the weekend is coming and I just wanted to share a nice read:

http://www.seahiker.com/does-your-body-type-really-matter-for-swimming/

Happy swimming everyone,
Salvo

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Re: Does your body type really matter for swimming?

Post by nightcrawler on Fri Feb 03, 2017 6:57 pm

Can he swim 8*100m free int:1:35(at 1:15 pace each)?

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Re: Does your body type really matter for swimming?

Post by SA on Fri Feb 03, 2017 8:47 pm

We are still crap swimmers Salvo. Slower than little Simmonds
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ewj5DzXWn7U

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Re: Does your body type really matter for swimming?

Post by s.sciame on Sat Feb 04, 2017 11:17 am

that's the point: if Simmonds can do that, we have no excuses ;-) That could be another challenge: beat Simmonds on the 400!

@NC: don't know if he could do that set, guess the message is that we don't need Phelps' body to do it. Perhaps Simmonds can do it.

Salvo

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Re: Does your body type really matter for swimming?

Post by nightcrawler on Mon Feb 06, 2017 9:30 am

s.sciame wrote:Hi all,
it's friday, the weekend is coming and I just wanted to share a nice read:

http://www.seahiker.com/does-your-body-type-really-matter-for-swimming/

Happy swimming everyone,
Salvo

Body type really matters in swimming. Come what may it is so!
Genelerally "being fit" and "being hyrodynamic" is being misunderstood by the people outside the swimming. For swimming faster not being fit but being hydrodynamic is essential.

Ask slow but well shaped people to show you the proper stroke mechanics on land. I bet they cant do them even on land, because their bodies wont let them to do.

I always come across with V shaped men, having nice sparkling muscles and definition, vessels are clearly seen on the bulging muscles, over 190cm tall, handsome guys, but they cant swim faster than me in all distances because their body types are not suitable for the water.

There are some genetical problems which are not suitable for the water, these problems cannot even let us to do the proper stroke mechanics(streamlining, high elbow pull, proper extension, lifting up the legs, dorsi flexion, hip rotation, exhaling and inhaling, etc...) on land, how can we do them in the water if we cant do them even on land:

Neck problems(also affects the inhalation and exhalation abilities):
http://neckpainsupport.typepad.com/.a/6a010534db265a970c013487aff5ee970c-320wi
http://healthandlovepage.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/08/Neck-Pain-Upper-Body-Postures-600x275.jpg

Lumbar lordosis:
https://ourquestus.files.wordpress.com/2015/10/lowerback.jpeg?w=300&h=169
https://ourquestus.files.wordpress.com/2015/10/curved-back-2.jpeg?w=300&h=169
As you can see, these athletes like many, swim backstroke with a large arch in the lower back, which is directly related to a lack of connection through the core.  While this arch in the back also greatly affects freestyle, from what we see issues at hand seems more prevalent in backstroke.  Such as an over development of certain muscles cause our athletes to develop a large arch in the lower back.  And while issues such a lumbar lordosis (often caused by tight hip flexors) might definitely come into play for older athletes.

Scoliosis:
http://images.medicaldaily.com/sites/medicaldaily.com/files/styles/headline/public/2015/02/02/scoliosis.jpg?itok=kK-GJvWe
http://www.formedhealthcare.com/Uploads/images/K%C4%B0FOZ%20KORSES%C4%B0.jpg

Kifosis:
http://uraiansehat.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/11/kifosis.jpg
http://doktor4.vspteknoloji.com/resimler/resimlerim/7_201419135731.jpg

Tortikolis:
http://www.verdeborgo.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/01/%C3%A7a%C4%9Fla-g%C3%B6rsel.jpg

Lack of Plantar Flexion:
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_q5DlpWweM4g/S2Cjwe-5XPI/AAAAAAAAACg/FJggkAKj8aU/s400/robert_breathe.PNG

Lack of shoulder mobility:
http://blog.paleohacks.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/10/How-to-Do-a-Shoulder-Mobility-Screen744.jpg
https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSqXKyW3s_zKYNgjDinsduXAfSi9Pf0uP0si07gLOPeE-dK1wLHyg
https://encrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRuNNPgZudVLHl5q19UzNHzPX2X2l0JdwDBStkWSPM4aTh2_9Bm

Lack of skeletal rotation and extension abilities:
https://encrypted-tbn3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSHBLT0bgdQblDVA2tB9jOYih2wNVH0FcG7WruP2F7ODEQCnXp5
https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQBcQbm1NaKfo7R4rncWto1-5X3cbXO-ErWL4nH1n2H7txlKvZd
http://www.kpjgolf.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/04/Shoulder-Flexibility-jpej1-1038x576.jpg

Lack of proper knee flexibility:
http://www.tour2india4health.com/pic/155.jpg
http://cdn.builtlean.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/yoga-for-back-pain-ankle-to-knee.jpg

Lack elbow and wrist flexion, extension and rotation:
https://encrypted-tbn1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcT1-R52NiRg12VMUf5GH0c56_B-vPYpLKDT8HzpDGMjUUDZtiqz
https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQDYyWGR4rOgksR5uxvanNHNfGhuEpDx_MevYGyijqNSE1NG5d1lQ

Bone Mass
Your skeletal system stores 99 percent of the calcium in your body, and calcium is the most abundant mineral in your body. Your skeletal system responds to exercise by taking in more calcium. Osteoblasts are cells that bring calcium into bones. Osteoblasts slow down and transport less calcium from your blood to your bones during inactivity, but exercise has the opposite effect and increases osteoblastic activity. Exercise that requires force through a particular bone strengthens that bone. Exercise helps you increase the density and strength of your bones, especially exercising regularly during the first three decades of life. But swimming doesnt like much more bone mass than the land sports, the less bone mass the more you float and swim faster.

Pshchology:
I was swimming 10x200m int:3:00 (with 2:32 tempo) in August 2016 while I was drinking beer every night, eating Mc Donald's everyday and smoking 2 pack of cigarette all the day, also I was also suffering from harsh asthama. At the moment I am 5 kilos less, quit alcohol and cigarette, have a more fit and muscular shape, fitting in my jeans with pleasure, eating salads and fish most of the week, feeling better, my asthama was treated, etc... but now I can do the above 10*200m int:3:00 set with 2:44 tempo. What am I doing wrong? Answer: At that time I m not paying the same attention on the trainings, just having fun, and using the pool as a social club, but now I am preparing for the 5K race. This is the difference!

Pizza, Coke, Potatoes and Hamburger Forever!
Also dont forget to smoke a cigarette with pleasure after a swim session, this will make you more happy and a faster swimmer!
Cheers for beers!
Very Happy

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Re: Does your body type really matter for swimming?

Post by s.sciame on Mon Feb 06, 2017 12:24 pm

nightcrawler wrote:
Pshchology:
I was swimming 10x200m int:3:00 (with 2:32 tempo) in August 2016 while I was drinking beer every night, eating Mc Donald's everyday and smoking 2 pack of cigarette all the day, also I was also suffering from harsh asthama.


Really??? Does the psychology aspect matter that much more than all the rest (better training, better life style etc)? Quite impressive...

Salvo

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Re: Does your body type really matter for swimming?

Post by nightcrawler on Mon Feb 06, 2017 12:40 pm

s.sciame wrote:
nightcrawler wrote:
Pshchology:
I was swimming 10x200m int:3:00 (with 2:32 tempo) in August 2016 while I was drinking beer every night, eating Mc Donald's everyday and smoking 2 pack of cigarette all the day, also I was also suffering from harsh asthama.


Really??? Does the psychology aspect matter that much more than all the rest (better training, better life style etc)? Quite impressive...

Salvo

The mind leads the body! Feeding your brain is more important than feeding your muscles. Such as an athlete driven by motivation and persistance is valuable then the gifted athlete. There is no force against the "persistance", persistence differ the good, better, the best. For showing your persistence you need to have a proper environment;
1) time is cash, you must be quite rich to have time to swim.
2) you must be rich to eat and rest well, maybe twice a week take massage for relaxation.
3) you must be living in a prosperous country which have swimming pools aroud your house.
4) you must have mates to motivate and make you swim faster.
5) you must have a good understarstanding of stroke mechanics(should be clever enough to understand and realize)
6) swimming doesnt love laziness, you should be hardoworking, swimming is a sport that requires 8 sessions a week for remarkable development.

Sports Pshchology is a big ocean of science Salvo, maybe more important than physiology in many cases, we read the related books in the trainership courses:
https://books.google.com.tr/books?id=4miTrcf7lmoC&pg=PA86&dq=swimming+sports+psychology&hl=tr&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjhpqOzo_vRAhXFWRoKHWgYBsEQ6AEIZDAJ#v=onepage&q=swimming%20sports%20psychology&f=false

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Re: Does your body type really matter for swimming?

Post by SA on Mon Feb 06, 2017 9:18 pm

How can you even swim if you think so much Nightcrawler? Very Happy

I can sit on my pointed feet with the knees raised avout 25 cm from the ground now. Ankle flex is still a limiter. Ankles offer stubborn resistance, but improvement hasnt totally stopped yet.
Also can wing the shoulderblades out much more than before. looking a bit like a freak swimmer in max streamline backward stretch.
These body adaptations are quite interesting. Its motivating that a body more than 50 years old still can transform into a swimmers shape.
But i think the main secret of swimming is how to fire the right muscles at the right time at the right intensity.
And the other one is fitness.

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Re: Does your body type really matter for swimming?

Post by nightcrawler on Tue Feb 07, 2017 9:18 am

Hi SA,
I cant swim well enough yet, still far from my 1:15 pace target Smile)
As for your remark: But i think the main secret of swimming is how to fire the right muscles at the right time at the right intensity.
I can recommend you a dry land exercise tool, do you know exergenie?

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Re: Does your body type really matter for swimming?

Post by SA on Wed Feb 08, 2017 9:16 am

But i think the main secret of swimming is how to fire the right muscles at the right time at the right intensity.

That describes any optimal physical activity, but it sounds interesting Smile

Dont know exergenie, but google will solve that.

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Re: Does your body type really matter for swimming?

Post by SA on Wed Feb 08, 2017 9:27 am

OK found it

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A596cForZwo

Pretty clever device..

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Re: Does your body type really matter for swimming?

Post by nightcrawler on Wed Feb 08, 2017 9:43 am

Exergenie is a isokinetic workout system. Isokinetic means that pertaining to the force of a human muscle that is applied during constant velocity of motion.

Muscles work in 3 primary forms:  Isotonic, Isometric and Isokinetic

Swimming is an isokinetic exercise. By lifting weights you cannot perform isokinetic exercise, so most of the dry land exercises are useless for swimming.

Exergenie is a very old tool(we were using it in the swim club when I was 8 years old), it is the father of vasa trainer, TRX, also more functional than these 2 brands.

Likewise, TI and SS's household drills, they have already been known even since J.Weissmuller's time, but those cunning marketing superheros sell them as if they were their brands. And whats more dramatic, they call it "A SYSTEM (TI system, SS system)". Swimmers know it so dont pay attention on these rubbish.

Recommend you to use exergenie mentality in your dry land workouts, dont buy it/dont pay to the marketing superheros, do it by yourself, just find a rope, wrap it to the door handle, set the intensity by screwing the rope, I did it and it works! Discover more by yourself... Smile)

Isokinetic exercise will help you to find out how to
"fire the right muscles at the right time at the right intensity"


Some videos:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P2iVqxWf3TI
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pT7e17h2A4M
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2M2EcyOg_QM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O8OXEk-OCIc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mBtxXlcGbk4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uz3JhdDu838


Last edited by nightcrawler on Wed Feb 08, 2017 2:05 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Re: Does your body type really matter for swimming?

Post by SA on Wed Feb 08, 2017 1:27 pm

Damn, I like that thing. And I have an idea to make it even better.
Maybe its possible to make a new TELL SELL product Smile

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Re: Does your body type really matter for swimming?

Post by nightcrawler on Wed Feb 08, 2017 2:03 pm

I guess you will be more successful in this business than swimming Very Happy

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Re: Does your body type really matter for swimming?

Post by s.sciame on Wed Feb 08, 2017 4:03 pm

In the end are we talking about stretch cords or am I missing something?

Salvo

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Re: Does your body type really matter for swimming?

Post by nightcrawler on Thu Feb 09, 2017 8:45 am

not "stretch cords" , isokinetic workout systems.

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Re: Does your body type really matter for swimming?

Post by s.sciame on Thu Feb 09, 2017 10:42 am

ok but, just to understand: when you say "just find a rope, wrap it to the door handle, set the intensity by screwing the rope, I did it and it works", can you describe the exercise(s) you did? Was it the same arm movement you do with Vasa Trainer (or stretch cords) for instance or was it something else?

Thx, Salvo

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Re: Does your body type really matter for swimming?

Post by nightcrawler on Thu Feb 09, 2017 10:48 am

Not exactly the same movements, you can create thousands of movements in isokinetic manner, actually you also dont need a rope too, I cant describe/write thousands of movements here, watch the videos above(also find more), they will be helpful. The principle here is not the movement but the way muscles work, "the effect and the response against the effect" which is called isokinetic exercise (likewise hitting the wall, if there is no effect there will be no response - like you do in the water, if you dont pull then you cant feel the resistance - but in other kind of exercises like weight lifting or like stretch cords there is still a strain even you dont apply and force effect).

Isokinetic exercise is a form of active exercise in which a muscle or group of muscles contracts against a controlled accommodating resistance which is moving at a constant angular velocity. The isokinetic exercise are performed with a specialized apparatus that provides variable resistance to a movement, so that no matter how much effort is exerted, the movement takes place at a constant speed.  This provides maximum resistance through the entire ROM.

Read more abaout isokinetic exercise, find on google...

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Re: Does your body type really matter for swimming?

Post by nightcrawler on Thu Feb 09, 2017 3:35 pm

SA wrote:Damn, I like that thing. And I have an idea to make it even better.
Maybe its possible to make a new TELL SELL product Smile

Hi SA,
I find out, discover, try many times and experience perfectly, if it is useful I take it.
So that, I never recommend something useless, everything I say has already been experienced by myself and has a place in my life! Very Happy

Check this out:
https://youtu.be/mBoX07AAMzI?list=UUWLOD1NVySL4dUyGU2UNKbw
You may create thousands of movements related with your imagination...

Also DONT FORGET TO check the video list:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OQ_alZboRBk&index=2&list=UUWLOD1NVySL4dUyGU2UNKbw

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Re: Does your body type really matter for swimming?

Post by SA on Fri Feb 10, 2017 1:07 am

I guess you will be more successful in this business than swimming Very Happy


Very Happy You may be right.


I dont see much improvement in the T2 turbo imitation against the exergenie.

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Re: Does your body type really matter for swimming?

Post by nightcrawler on Fri Feb 10, 2017 8:00 am

Hi SA, first you should swim a basic 400m sub 6 min, then you may comment on my success in swimming Smile

All of them are marketing bullshits(i mean the brands not the system, system has already be known for a century). Thats why i recommmended you not to buy but to do it by yourself.

Dont tell them, they may fire me out of the forum, because truth hurts, just like it hurted SS Smile

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